Exploring the World of Miniatures with Kat Picot: Publisher of Shrunk Magazine

Hello everybody and welcome to In the Dawn World, a show spotlighting the passion and the people of the Dawn community With your host, georgette Taylor, former vice president and co-founder of Big Beautiful Dolls. Join her as she talks to fascinating Dawn artists, customizers, avid collectors, redesigners, authors and all the people in between, as they share their journeys, give us glimpses into their processes and will propel their passion and drive that help to keep the Dawn World moving and shaking. Welcome to the show, hello everybody, and welcome to another episode of In the Dawn World. I'm so excited that you're joining me today. I have such a wonderful guest. I know I say I have wonderful guests all the time, but I do. I love all the people come and say yes to being on In the Dawn World and sharing the things that they do. So today we have Kat Pico. She is the publisher of Shrunk, which is a modern miniatures magazine, and I'm so excited to talk to her about how she got started, what made her do a miniatures magazine for miniatures and what her background is. So thank you so much, kat, for being on In the Dawn World.

Thank you very much for having me. I was really excited to get your email and, yeah, it's been a while since I've had a good mini chat actually, so it's exciting.

I'm excited to talk to you about it, because when I found the magazine, I was just fascinated by it. One thing I do want to say before I ask you this question is that the magazine is beautifully done. It is to me it looks like an architectural digest kind of thing, which I think is so cool. It's just a beautiful look to the magazine. So thank you very much. You're so welcome, so please share a little bit about yourself with our listeners, and where you're from and how you decided to get the inspiration to come up with a magazine about miniatures.

So I'm based in. I'm actually back in Kent on the coast, which is the southeast of England, in the UK. So shrunk happened during lockdown. So the first lockdown that we had over here in the UK and I'd just been made redundant, I was living in Brighton, which is a really lovely city, just sort of a couple of hours up the coast from where we are now and just started a new job. It was a really exciting role. I was really happy to be doing it, but it was the case for many people, unexpected circumstances and it was kind of a few weeks in after the sort of the shock of it all had sort of gone a little bit and I was just thinking what can I do? I kind of keep busy. And so the background to me sort of being this level of obsessed with doll houses my first ever job when I was 14 was in a doll's house shop. So my hometown in Favisham in Kent it's got lots of really old medieval Tudor buildings and there's this old pharmacy building and it's like grade two star listed. You can't do anything with it, there's no heating in it, it's freezing in the winter, but what was perfect about it is that it's still. If you could ever visit Favisham. It's still there. It's now a really lovely knitting yarn shop. They've still got all the original fixtures from where it was a pharmacy in. It's like all these little wooden sort of alcoves and tiny drawers, which is perfect like the stock for when it was a doll's house shop. Everything was like stored in these little drawers. It was just like the pharmacy alcoves. It was just incredible, like for both. I was spoiled really for my first ever job and sadly they closed down sort of. Just so I was leaving school, which you know I think if she hadn't done I would have just stayed there forever because it was just the dream and it was amazing. And then kind of fast forward I'd sort of gone off to uni and moved to London and done some jobs sort of after my degree and things and I kind of kept picking up dolls, how like as a hobby. I kept sort of dipping back into it, did a bit of blogging. So I launched it was just like for fun. I just did this blog sort of while I was job, untinkled for little walls, and just started sort of sharing bits and bumps that I was sort of making for myself on there and has a sort of online like e-commerce store for a few years under the four walls handle. And I'd sort of round all that up sort of just in the year before COVID and had sort of gone back to uni and done my masters in journalism and then sort of when the redundancy happened, I was just like, well, maybe I should just write something. I was like, well, now would be great doll's house time because I can really just indulge in it without feeling guilty because of what's going on in the time. And I was like, oh, I should just go back to blogging or maybe a magazine because, like where the journalism masters had sort of kicked in, I was like, yeah, I'll just do something, really over the top. And after a few glasses of wine I was sort of saying to Eddie, I'm going to make a magazine. And he was just like, are you okay? Great. And then, yeah, and then he'd sort of go off to work he was doing delivery driving during the pandemic. He'd sort of go off for 12 hours and come back and just find me sort of surrounded by cuttings and like things. That I was just like scribbling out like it's happening, we're doing a magazine. And yeah, so that's where it started really for a place of insanity, really Just alone in a basement, flat and bright, in isolation from everyone.

Who knows what could have came out of that right Exactly.

But the amazing thing was like, from that physically very isolating place was like I kind of just I thought, well, you know, now I know I'm calling it, I'll make the Instagram profile, and just put the fingers out a little bit and I kind of shared on my full little wall on Instagram. I'm like, oh, I'm just, I'm thinking I'm going to do this. Just, you know, keep you posted Right. And went to bed and overnight friends and followers in America just shared and shared and shared it and I was just inundated with just really lovely comments and messages the next morning being like yes, when is it happening? Like we want to read it. I was like, oh, okay, so I'll do it then. And so issue one was a Kickstarter campaign, which I've done before and was quite a good learning curve. It was lots to sort of absorb and learn and figure out. A few mistakes along the way were made and that was fine. That's, you know, you learn.

That's the part of growth, right. That's the part of starting anything, right yeah?

And knew I wanted it to look like an interior magazine, like Dolls houses, like once a child has always been like my sort of comfort zone really, and so that's kind of how it was forming in my mind. I want it to be modern. I don't want it to like just be dolls houses. I want it to be like mixed sort of mixed media artists and dioramas and model makers and set designers and and dolls Although I kept thinking like dolls need to come in at some point. And then we got through issue six and I still hadn't quite cracked it. We're on a hiatus from printing and production currently. Really well, partly I had a baby and then so that was between issue four and five. There's a little bit of that, despite my meticulous planning. She we were going to have the Christmas issue. Issue Issue five was supposed to be the Christmas issue and I was like this is fine. So I was fully self-employed at that point. So I had the flexibility and I was just like, very naively, we were still in the same flat with the magazines grown from. It was a tiny bedroom place and we're just thinking babies are small, they're not going to need.

She's not going to take us through. They need everything. Oh my gosh.

And she walked up six weeks early. So that kind of fully derails everything really. And so kind of just put a pin in that, while we caught up a little bit and then I think it was like she came along in the November and then the March I started working on the next issue. Okay, yeah, again, quite naively, I thought I'd just be able to keep up that pace. I was like you know, she'll nap and I'll just get the work done when she's napping. Well, obviously that is reality. So, yeah, I was really. I was really like happy to get issue five and six, but an issue six was the most recent ones. That was actually. It's here actually. So this was the one that I'd really wanted to do. I really wanted to do like a sort of festive theme so pretty. And it's like the Christmas issue that I've been really longing to do, and then Christina's amazing photography on the front. So some of the tradition. She was actually our cover star for issue five, and then the projects that came in for issue six, like they're all beautiful and like so well Beautiful. But I was just like but it that is like the Christmas interior, like vision that I'd had?

How many publications were you planning on doing per? Was it gonna be monthly and then you switched accordingly, or had you already started out saying you know, I'm gonna do accordingly or monthly? How did you decide to?

start doing it. So in the very early early days, when I was launching the first Kickstarter, I was like it's gonna be bi-monthly, I'm gonna do six a year and very, very quickly realized that was not going to be sustainable, you know as one person running it mostly from an iPhone. So I was like, okay, I'm gonna do it quarterly. And then we kind of got there. But then issue four like came and went, and then obviously I was the break when along came baby. So yeah, because, as I said, we're on hiatus at the moment, I feel like there's more to do, like there's more. I still want to do that and there's just more fun to be had there still. So I don't want to leave it there. We've moved three times in the last year and a half as well, so that's obviously. But now we're settled and I've got the office space. So I would like to get it bi-annually again, like maybe two a year, realistically, oh, wow, okay, and just maybe. I think what's gonna be more sustainable for me is like, maybe going back to sort of like digital content and online content for a little while. It's just a faster turnaround.

Yeah, I think it's a faster turnaround and it's easier to lay out with because you started off with just so when you started off, it was just a hard copy of the magazine. Then you switched to digital. When did you switch to digital?

So I've always done. It's been print first and then the digital edition. So, I don't know why. Because obviously, like, digital publishing is cheaper, like quite some way, and I think because I love a printed magazine, the penny sort of dropped like much later than it should have. Really. Like I did the launch issue and I'm like, oh well, I am really easy to. Just now I've made the thing like actually just doing a digital version is really strict for it. So it's like light bulb moment. I was like, yeah, why haven't you done that already? So there are digital versions available, although the platform I have been using, unfortunately, just in the last couple of months have like retired their app. So, I'm kind of just sussing out like what's gonna be the like the most user friendly platform? To like move to next, without really breaking the bank.

So when you started out and you said, okay, I'm gonna you're being a journalism major, I know you probably do a lot of the content writing part of that, but you still have to get pictures done and you still have to lay stuff out. And so who did you bring on to do that for you? Because I'm sure you had to photograph some stuff, or is everything submitted to you and then you lay it out?

You know, I was just really, really fortunate that so all the cover images were all shot by the contributors themselves Someone on iPhone. Yeah, so issue one was shot on an iPhone.

Oh, I love that, I just love that.

Yeah, and it was just like. I mean, I'm not a graphic designer, so I did the design, I did the layouts for issue one and two. I had a very, very basic knowledge of in design and I did the layouts and it was excruciating. And then, by issue three, I was like this might have to, like just for the sake of time speed, like even with all the time that we had sort of in lockdown, I was like this needs to speed up a little bit. And I was very, very lucky to receive an email from the lovely Amelia who we'd never met in person. It turned out we were actually we kind of just crossed paths. We'd gone to the same university to do our masters Like I was just finishing wine and she was just starting hers and she's an incredibly talented professional graphic designer. Oh nice, she's got a real passion for like independent brands and she'd seen the magazine and really loved it. She wasn't really from a sort of miniatures or doll background. She really liked the concept and like the magazine and she should order the copy. And she was like I just wanted to get in touch and say like I loved it. I just had a few ideas, like I'm really like keen to work on a magazine like this, and I was just like yes, please take it Nice, nice. Do whatever you want to do with it and like she was, yeah, she was just incredible to work with because I was very much like learning as we went with everything Right and yeah. So she was just a very sort of like calm, steady presence, which is perfect and it just, yeah, it worked really well. So she's Amelia designed issues three to six.

OK, all right, beautiful yeah, they laid out very, very, very nicely yeah.

And so in terms of like the projects and like featured artists, basically if we had a last minute sort of emergency, like if, for whatever reason, some content hadn't come through or you know, people have emergencies and they weren't, Especially during that time period.

Like everyone.

Yeah, like up in the air, so sometimes I'd have to like rustle something up really quickly because we had a print, then She'd something on my iPhone, but mostly all the images were from the contributors and the artists, and I'm always just in awe of how multi talented everybody is, because it's like, you know, they're making the things and then they're photographing the things and then they're keeping their Instagrams updated and they're, you know, depending on kind of how they're operating, they might be running a Etsy store and they were going to show it. Like it's incredible really just how many things people are turning their hand to. But yeah, I don't, I'd never hired a photographer, never needed to hire a photographer, and which also, like the flexibility of that and just because everybody was able to sort of provide such a big film, is just that way. And it just meant that we were able to like I didn't realize it was going to be quite as international in terms of content, because I had a few people say, oh, you're in the UK, and I'd be like, yeah, I'm in the UK and they kind of, I think, just from where a lot of the featured artists were, from the States and from Canada. Oh, we just thought it was an American publication. I don't know, I mean England, so which was? And again, I think I don't know if that would have happened quite in the same way if it weren't for the pandemic, because everybody was online and communicate far and it just suddenly made it feel like not impossible. But you know, I can do a magazine and I'm going to make it with, you know, six other people per issue and they're going to be the other side of the world and that's just going to be fine and it was, and it was, yeah, it was really really fantastic fun and I think the best part of all of it has just been to have just chats like this and just to me so many lovely people and just hear about all the kind of different avenues into the hobby.

So how do you curate your content then? Like, do you like I mean, do you search everything and you contact everybody and like case them in your stuff, or are you a little bit more? You know particular in how you do that?

It's kind of a mixture of all of it. I kind of, when I was setting out, I kind of thought you know, maybe I'd like see you each issue, and I found that was quite a start off, maybe, as having a theme and then just be a bit like, oh, is that a bit? But if I really wanted to speak to this person, it didn't quite fit this theme that I've given myself. So I kind of tried to keep it eclectic and then kind of I suppose the Christmas one was probably the most themed, in that there was seasonal projects and kind of that sort of festive vibe. I think Issue Three is the one where the first one where we had Amelia on board as the designer as well. So this was actually the summer issue and we had this gorgeous Spanish style house in the front and we had a swimming pool project and we had like ice lolly project and things like that, and that was kind of like a nice summer, fun one, but still had like lovely mini interiors in there. So yeah, trying to strike a balance, but mostly it would be I'd have an idea of who I'd want to approach but also probably say 50 50. I'd have an idea of people I wanted to speak to, but also I was just really fortunate to have lots of very enthusiastic people approaching me just being like I'm working on this, do you want to see it? And I'm like, yes, I do, thank you. So yeah, it was just, it was quite a nice collaborative effort.

Right, yeah, I love it because I just, you know, I never thought that I, for I think the last year and a half probably, I've been really fascinated about miniatures. You know, I just I just find the work to be so fascinating to me. I mean I could be able to. I could barely create anything in regular size, you know. So just to think about creating something in miniature, and some of the stuff is so detailed and so beautiful that it's just it, just it just floors me. And so when I saw your magazine, I was just like this is the coolest thing I've seen in such a long time, you know. So do you have a specific area, genre of miniatures that fascinates you the most?

You know, in that, in that area, I think I mean to be honest, part of the reason I did the magazine and kind of felt that need to sort of just like write all the stuff is because I have a real problem with like picking, just choosing and like deciding on things. So I've got my own doll's houses, like I've got one that I bought. So when I was working at that doll's house shop when I was 14, I saved my wages for a year. It was like a mini mortgage and I paid it off every week, which is a very savvy business move on the part of my boss. So she's basically paying me and it was all kind of right. And I paid off this doll's house for a year and it was completely impractical, like the biggest one, and then like it's just always been at my mom and dad's because it's been too big, like whenever I've been renting, and it's always been tiny like flats and apartments, like it's not been practical to like move this in almost all houses. It's still there and I just had to have it, but at that point it was. We just watched, like the BBC's Pride and Prejudice with my auntie.

So I guess it's like a Prejudice house.

And then kind of when I came back to the hobby I was like, oh, I kind of want it to be like a house I want to live in and that's kind of that stage, true, I think, and kind of channel through the shrunk. It's like that modern. I want it to be like my dream house or the house that I aspire to own one day and sort of make decorating choices you perhaps wouldn't make in a real house. Right, just all of it really fascinates me. I think I really I love miniatures but like work like the real versions. That always that fascinates me because I think just the precision and the skill some of these like artists have to be able to make like a working Swiss Army knife or a work tiny umbrella and like the tiny sort of like mechanical toys where, like, you wind the tiny little handle and it's like you know it's got five different moving parts and like a sort of real, like old fashioned toy. Yeah, just a bit of everything really which is yeah. Again, that's why I did the magazine. So I kind of think I'll get it out my system more if I just cover it in there and like speak to a lot of different people that are doing something. Then I don't actually need to do all of those different things or lecture on those different things. And so most recently I have I've always been like controversially, I appreciate for your audience, I've not been in the doll camp in terms of dolls houses, because it's like for me it's been about the imperias and like taking those photos and it's like the trick of like showing someone a photo of a miniature room and there's that, oh, is it real or is it mini? And like that's what I love about. Like, yeah, I follow such a mixture of like real life interior accounts and miniature accounts on Instagram and you'll be scrolling and you go, oh wait, hang on, that's not a real room. And like, even now, like where you spend, you know more than a normal amount of time looking at dolls houses, like you can still get tricked, and so my feeling was always like if you put a doll in there, like the illusion's gone straight away. Having said that much like with the dolls houses, I really love dolls just in their own rights, like. But then I was just like, oh, but when I want Barbies or when I want a blind doll, and then it's like you can really go down the rabbit hole and then you've got like you know the real custom, like artisan dolls, and you're like, oh, no, this is gonna be like a whole other thing, then you're going into a bigger scale. So if you get the doll like an furniture and then that's, you know, it's a dangerous, a dangerous spiral to go down, I think. But having said that, we recently committed to our first, our first Christmas doll. I found her a little charity shop around the corner, but apparently she is Hollywood hair Barbie.

Okay, yes, Hollywood hair Barbie.

yes, she's missing her boots but I have sourced some so they are available on the internet. And my mom's like that's not really for the baby, is it? I was like no, no, it's not.

So how did you decide to do the layout for the magazine? You know, I know you feature artists, but how did you decide to do the rest of that? What did you want to bring into that magazine to make it? I mean, it's already different, you know, because there's not that many magazines out there, a few more, but yeah, I mean there's a few.

So my first kind of like work experience after I'd finished university, when I was like 21, 22, I worked for a little craft publishers here in the UK and at the time they had a quite established like doll. It was called the Dolls House Magazine and they were a really lovely team and like the editor had been on it, I think, at like maybe 10 or 12 years at that point and like it was quite. I think it was like one of maybe two in the UK and there was maybe a couple more in the US and I think there was a couple more like in Europe, like in the Netherlands and things, but they weren't English language ones, so it's not. I just didn't really access them really, when I was there in my 20s I kind of remember like freaking through these magazines and just being like, oh, it's just not exciting. It hadn't really. You know, when I was 14 in the Dolls House Shop and seeing these magazines, that was the only sort of material that had like well, like there was no Instagram and the internet hadn't quite sort of. I think there was a few blogs, but I hadn't really like found all of that yet. Yeah, I was just like, oh, it's all just a bit like the same. So kind of, when I was starting out with Shronka, I just wanted to be like, you know, just exciting and fun, you know, and just a bit more accessible. I mean, yeah, and just I hopefully just keeping it fun.

And it's like what do you see for Shronka as a magazine, like, how broad do you want it to be? How you know? Do you see it as being a, I guess, influencing? You know more of the world of miniatures for other people to know what's out there? Like what do you see the magazine doing?

I mean, I was really, I was just still just like blown away by the response it got just the very, very warm kind of welcome I got, like you know, I was contacted by, and I still get contacted by people who I've never met and like they live the other side of the world and just you know they'll be like just really excited to talk about it and like talk about the magazine or talk about miniatures or like you know, and just show me what they've been working on and you know, so kind of I'd like to. Well, I hope that we can like continue on that and build on that. I think, just from a personal level, I need to sort of figure out how to move it forward in a way that is sustainable, obviously because life behind the scenes has changed quite drastically in quite a short space of time, like when the magazine started to know, yeah, trying to figure out how I can, sort of like, get it all, you know, keep it all moving forward.

Keep it all moving forward right.

Losing my mind Right.

How to establish it for growth right.

Yeah, yeah, without being overwhelmed, yeah, and I think I mean from a financial point of view. I feel like sort of having our roots in Kickstarter campaigns. I feel like that is potentially going to be like what happens for like the relaunch. I'm hoping, if not by the end of this year, like early next, we'll have a plan about how issue 7 is going to happen. So, yeah, which I am, I'm getting, I'm at a place where I'm like getting excited about that now rather than just being like terrified Because I don't know how much of it sort of was heard about in the States. But so when issue 6 came out here coincided with these, you know, biggest we've ever had, like union strikes, you know, with our postal work across the country, royal Mail just ground to a halt and again in January there was a couple of issues was now the Royal Mail system got hacked and so it had a huge impact on international deliveries and I think it was the week before Christmas and obviously the majority of my everything I've sold from issue 1 through to now still everything goes to North America, which I didn't expect. I like, when I launched it, I really didn't. I just I don't know, I don't know why. I just I don't. I didn't realize people that far away would be the ones to find out about it. First because it's funny, because people in the UK still be like I really just found you. I was like, oh no, and I had, I had like 400 magazines in the post just stuck. And because it's not a pass, I was just there's all this sort of bureaucracy and everything around all of that and I just sort of froze and I just sort of had a quick add up of you know, because then the emails start coming. People were keen to get their orders in time for Christmas or if they were having time off, they wanted to sort of be doing the crafting while they're off of work. And then I was just like, if I like, if none of these people get their magazines, if everything just doesn't get delivered and I have to refund and or replace, it was kind of devastating, sort of emotionally and financially really, because so much work and sort of, from you know, probably the biggest group of people so far like the support team I'd had for issue six, because that was another Kickstarter had been, yeah, just like a real sort of gargantuan group effort from a lot of very lovely people. And yeah, it was kind of just really devastating to like suddenly realize, like, oh, this is you know what was that about me? It's like I will never financially recover and yeah, so I just I just sort of pulled the shutters down in the shop. It was just like I cannot ship anything else until there's back up clears which I don't know when that's going to clear. And it was just, yeah, and it's like you know, you're one person. It's like, of course, people you need to keep in touch with your customers, but it was like the busiest time of being all they got and I was just like. I think that was the moment where I was like, yeah, actually I need to, sort of, just because I planned out this year kind of the production schedule and the printing deadlines, I'd sort of spoken with Amelia about her availability and we had all this conversation. So issue seven, eight and nine were planned out in September in terms of scheduling and I was just like I don't, I don't think I can do another one yet. So I think I just need to like take a pause, yes, and regroup.

Yes, exactly, exactly.

Yeah. I would hope that, yeah, I could just do more of the same and, as I said, there's just more that I want to explore with it in terms of projects and artists that I haven't. I'm still really keen to sort of meet and speak to and feature, because you know also where I've sort of taken my head out of it or not been on Instagram sort of so much over the last couple of months. It's like whenever I do get a moment to sort of put back online and just have to tell myself, oh, this is amazing, like look what that person's worked on, all this person's like you know, there's a project that's moved on, you know, to a completely new phase since I last saw it. So yeah, I mean, and that's, you know, that's what I feed off of as well. It's just, you know, I can't. You know, I'm not an artist, I'm a miniaturist, but I really love sort of just curating all of the exciting things that I find that's probably like the most exciting bit really.

Most exciting thing. Yeah, I totally understand that. That's how I feel with the show. It's, in a way, it's about curating right All the different artists and people that are in the documentary. You know, to just show up and share what it is that they do. You know, I think that's always pretty cool, do you so? Are there a artist that you have wanted to have featured in the magazine that you have not been able to get? Or, you know, do you have your fangirl moment in that space, like I think I've had a fangirl moment with like every person. Yeah, exactly, we understand. Yeah, I feel that way too. It's so cool. Yeah, it's hard isn't it?

I mean, yeah, there's a couple of people that. So Lauren, who is Southern Gothic Dolls House on Instagram, she is fantastic and just prolific. Like if I had half her energy and brain, like it would just be incredible. Like in terms of what she explores and shares and researches, like she's so like detail-oriented and everything it's like it's not just the Dolls House project, she's very the literature sort of that she's sharing behind the scenes and like that she's applied like this whole narrative and storyline.

Right right.

Layers and layers of detail.

Right.

Something else and we had a really lovely chat during knockdown, before Shrunk existed and I was just going to resurrect my Tall Little Walls blog and I was just going to write a blog post and then I over, I overthought it too much because, like I think we had a really lovely chat and I was like, okay, so like try and pull yourself together and get an article out of it, and then the sort of the shrunk idea was happening. I was like, oh, but like then I could put her in shrunk. And then I was like, oh, but it's, it's really not a modern doll's house, it's very, like you know, gothic looking and like you know. But it's sort of the storyline is that it's modern day and you're looking at this sort of decaying house, so right. Time capsule, which is and like you know she's really into like the horror genre, which is not not my cup of tea at all. I can't watch horror films, I'm too scared to catch, so but it's quite interesting just hearing more about that side of it. Then I sort of over thought it too much and I was like, oh, when I do like a sort of Halloween issue that right, that's what I was thinking.

That would be the perfect, exactly yeah.

And then so I guess, yeah, I would really, really, really love to just feature her work in print, but I save everything to my Instagram like saved Amazing, and I want to talk to that person and when I'm you know, when it's time, I'm going to go back to them and talk to them about this, right, okay. At some point, the Instagram reel will come out.

That's what I do too. I just take snapshots sometimes. Yeah, you know people that I want to talk to because I will forget you know who they are, or and then I have to go back and be like, oh yeah, it's that person. Let me let me, you know, let me reach out to that, so yeah. So I know it's an independent publication. You know there's definitely always challenges, right?

You know, financially, I'm sure, being the number one, like in any business, right, what has been, what has been a few other challenges and what has been some of the rewards of you doing this, this, this magazine, I don't know, and I don't want to kind of bore everyone with like the sort of I mean the challenge of logistics, I would say, and the thing being, you know you're one person, it's like making the magazine and I really underestimated how much of a sort of time drain like the packing orders and processing the orders are going to be again, probably quite naively, I think, when I did the launch issue I was like, oh, I'll print like 200 copies, Like my mom will read one, my boyfriend will read it, but that's the thing too.

Sometimes you do that and you just don't think that it's going to be. You know as big as it is, or get to be. You know, reach, like you said, more people than you expect. You're like, oh, I'm just going to do this magazine and probably a few people read it, you know. And then all of a sudden things change and it's like now I have to figure out, okay, how am I going to change with that and how and how I'm going to. You know, keep that flow. So I'm not going crazy.

Yeah, with the growth Exactly. So I'd say, yeah, logistics is definitely the biggest challenge. So that's sort of my number one, sort of as and when there is an issue seven. I would like to kind of for that to be sorted first and foremost, like in terms of challenges, and also, again, it's just the postage. It was such an issue from issue one to issue six, so that was just shy of three years in terms of like timeline and, yeah, like two and a half to three years and the international shipping restrictions changed so much. So I think issue one was really quite straightforward because you know it's just, it's one magazine that was going in a paper envelope and that was, you know, in terms of customs, you know we're in the EU and that was fine and like I think Australia was like the most complicated one. I'm always so excited and grateful to anyone who's international and ordering a magazine because I understand the postage is eye watering, but the Australians were literally paying almost double the price of the magazine for the postage so I was just like thank you very much and I really hope you like it Right.

You know also, especially during the pandemic, because it's an investment for them.

Yeah, and then they would wait like three months for it to arrive because Wow yeah, how long it was taking. So, yeah, I mean, like that was sort of like you get really excited about creating this like fun magazine and talking about Dolls' Houses and getting to sort of spend the afternoon like making something and photograph, forget and writing it all up and doing all the fun stuff, and then sort of a week or two down the line you're like, oh no, I've got to just sit and literally write customs labels for a day, but again, it's all. It was all good learning curves and kind of figuring out how to sort of you know, the bigger it was getting, I was just, you know, you need another solution to this. You need to find there must be a way to make this easier, right, and yeah, just reaching out to like even if it wasn't people that were sort of independent publishing or just people who were like used to running like an independent business or like any sort of that e-commerce side of it, was sort of invaluable really.

What have been the rewards? Because obviously those outweigh the challenges, because you're still doing the magazine. So what are the rewards of you doing that.

I mean getting to go to Kensington Dolls' House Festival. So it's in London. I'd been like numerous times over the years from when I was like a teenager, but it wasn't always practical, either because I wasn't, I was working or like I just didn't have the money to sort of do the trip to London and go into a Dolls' House. Show you kind of well, if I'm going to go, like you need to have a bit of spending money, otherwise why are you going? But like sometimes I would just go with like 10 pounds to spend and just be like looking at all these dolls. But yeah, so Kensington Dolls House Festival. So it was the September of 21. So it had been almost a year and I think we heard a she-three just, and it was a real sort of like that was the first pinch for me, partly because it was we were just getting used to like being out in public with everyone again, right, right, so sort of being together. And I was quite pregnant by that point and it was the first time I'd ever like taken shrunk like out into the real world, like be on the living room and just posting it. It was like putting it in front of people and like seeing what they thought of it in real time and it was just incredible and like to be like Kensington has always been that sort of like. I don't know, I guess it would be like when you're a kid like seeing like a Disney film or like going to you know, that sort of like butterflies in your tummy, exciting sort of like. This is amazing. And it was that sort of moment and my sister came with me and we stayed in the hotel around the corner, so it was two days it was the Friday and Saturday and it was, like it, really fun and also I'm really I'm not the best sales person and I think as well, when it's your own thing, like your own projects, like I found it really hard to just be like yes, this is amazing and you should buy it. Right right, Whereas one of my sisters she's really like she's always worked in retail, she loves it, she's very passionate about like great customer service and like getting all the information across. And you know she's listened to me talk about doll's houses for the last sort of 30 odd years, so she and she was like such a brilliant sort of ringman to have and, yeah, it was just like that was a real, like core memory. I just think you know, regardless of where Shrunk goes, and like just having that first, like okay, I've made a magazine and now we're here and it's lovely. And actually Charlotte, who runs Kensington Dolls House Festival, she phoned me Like, she messaged me Like I think within a day or two of me making that first Instagram profile, there was no content, there was no magazine, and she was like, oh, can we have a chat? And so we spoke on the phone and she was just like I don't know what it is yet, but, like you know, I'm excited and I love it and I want this to work because I think this is such a great idea, and I was just like it was just so. Yeah, that was a bit of a fan girl moment because it was like Kensington Dolls House Festival has always been like like, yeah, like, yeah like this year that would be like you know year made sort of thing like highlight and just as like a customer but yeah, but to go there like as a vendor with the magazine was just like best and we were really fortunate we were able to get back there. So not for the December one, so we did the September one and then obviously, when my because I was again naively just being like, oh well, she's not due until like such and such a date in December, but it's, you know, she'll probably be late, so I'll do the Christmas show and Charlotte was like, please don't have a baby at the Dolls House show, it'll be fine. But as it turned out I did have, maybe early. So my sister and her partner very lovingly went and just did like they did the show and sort of represented Trump for me in my absence which was really lovely. Neither of them are remotely into miniatures or dolls or anything, but they just as an event, they just really want to go and, yeah, support you yeah.

Yeah, like, this is not the genre I'm really into, but I'll help you do that and that's great, you know, and those are the people you need them to. You know what I mean? Yeah, not everybody has to be into what it is that you're into, but if you have people who still want to support you regardless, you know that's the important thing.

Yeah yeah, it was just yeah, just lots of lovely, just sort of like, just like little moments from that whole period. Really, it was just yeah, it was an exciting time. And yeah, I think I hope to get it to that sort of exciting, busy phase again.

Yeah.

And I think, out of necessity, it just it will look slightly different. Before just figuring out how it's all going to come together still, currently Okay.

Okay, so that's kind of where you're at, but I know it's going to get there because I mean, like I said, I just it's not even the fact that it's the magazine, it's just that it looks beautiful. You know, and if people are going to look at things and they're going to spend their time investing in a magazine and bringing it home, they want to see something that's beautifully done. And you, you and your team have definitely done that really, really well. You know, really it just really when I, when I'm telling you, when I saw it, I was just like this is like the best, the best, coolest magazine.

I love it. I guess that was like a second to it being like like a mini interiors magazine I kind of was conscious of I wanted it to be something that didn't like lose its value quickly, so kind of consciously not put like shopping features in there, really Right.

Right.

Unless it's like a lovely photo and it's sort of just like something to look at. It's stage nicely, it's style nicely Right, and it's like, rather than just like, here's this thing for this price and here's this thing for this price Right.

It's probably not that type of magazine.

Yeah and it's. You know, I mean I love, I love a bit of mini shopping, but I just think that needs to be something that's like quick and moves on quickly, especially when you've got people who may be doing like really small, like sort of batches of things or one of a kind items Like I kind of think not a lot of, unless you're like showcasing their sort of portfolio, it's right from a shopping point of view. I kind of think by the time it gets to print, you risk disappointing quite a lot of people.

So you're at the stage now where you are you have you done the last magazine for the year and then you're going to be doing your focusing now on next year.

Yeah, so yeah, I kind of, as I said, I had this sort of grand plan for how 2023 was going to go. So like now we're looking ahead to 2024 more now. So kind of I'm hoping to get it together a bit, and quarterly at the stage is probably still a bit of a stretch. So I'm thinking we're going to just kind of have a bit of a pivot and just like we're just going to be a bye annual magazine. Currently, I just don't want to over stretch and over promise, right?

I totally understand. First, I wanted to say thank you so much for sharing what it is that you do. That gives the artists a great opportunity, you know, to showcase their talent in your magazine, and what I love about it is that it also gives people who are who are listening or watching the show an opportunity to see the vastness of being in the doll community. So you don't have to make a doll right, but if you make managers and you make other things like that, you could still be. You know you can, your work can still be seen and I think that's important because people out there doing their work so it can be shared, and the fact that you have such a great magazine to showcase their talent, I think, is just really so, so helpful for them.

Yeah, I mean, that's definitely.

So where can people get your magazine and find out more about? Yeah, find out more about it.

So if you go to shrunkmagazinecom you'll find I've got some back issues that are available on there and also make some available on the Etsy store periodically as well, just to bypass international shipping. Just streamlines that process a bit more. Make sure about things like that. So if you're in the States or if you're in the EU, head to Etsy. If you're in the UK you can head to shrunkmagazinecom, and also there's going to be we're actually going to close for a couple of weeks. So we're going to have a little break until the first week of September, just going to sort of refresh the website a little bit and hopefully start just bringing some digital content as well, kind of get the creative brain ticking over again. So the the main website, shrunkmagazinecom, will be the place to be for that.

Okay, great, well, good. I'm glad we're going to get to see some more digital content. That'd be great.

Yeah, because I've kind of like I've got this like spreadsheet that I've been keeping for like the last little six months. I've kind of like a flicker of an air like quick, write that down before you forget and we'll come back to it, um, but yeah, I'm excited. I'm excited and I'll. Thank you so much. It's been so lovely to chat, to chat with you.

Thank you so much, kat, for being on In the Dawn World with me. I really appreciate you sharing your wonderful story and your magazine with all the listeners and I'm so excited that they're going to get a chance to see the kind of work that you are presenting and you know and learning more about the artists that are that are in the miniature world. So thank you for doing that.

Oh, thank you, my pleasure, thank you.

Thank you, Thanks again. Bye, Bye, Hello everybody. Thank you so much for listening to In the Dawn World. I hope you enjoyed the show. Please don't forget to share the podcast with other doll enthusiasts such as yourself. They can find us at Facebook, Instagram and Twitter at In the Dawn World. The show can also be downloaded on all apps with podcasts or streamed To see videos of our interviews. Please visit our In the Dawn World YouTube channel. And don't forget, In the Dawn World is also on Alexa. Just ask Alexa to open Dawn World. Did you know that you can now leave a voicemail or give us a review? We would love to hear from you or suggest a guest for the show. You can do all that by visiting wwwinthedaworldcom and, until next week, add a little play into your life by collecting a doll, sharing a doll or giving a doll a home. And again, thank you for listening to In the Dawn World.